Team v France

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niall
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Team v France

Post by niall » Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:18 pm

so what is your preferred selection for saturday, and what do you think Hadden will go with?!


mine:

1. Jacobsen
2. Ford
3. ? - i like Dickenson, but i'm not sure of his scrummaging ability
4. Hamilton
5. Hines (if fit, if not, Kellock)
6. Strokosh
7. Barclay
8. Brown

9. Cusiter
10. Godman
11. Lamont
12. Morrison
13. M.Evans
14. T.Evans
15. Paterson

I thought Southwell had a shocker, and Cairns and Webster weren't that good. Would like to see Jackson on the bench though.

Haddens team:

1 Allan Jacobsen (Edinburgh)
2 Ross Ford (Edinburgh)
3 Geoff Cross (Edinburgh)*
4 Jason White (Sale Sharks)
5 Jim Hamilton (Edinburgh)
6 Allister Hogg (Edinburgh)
7 John Barclay (Glasgow Warriors)
8 Simon Taylor (Stade Francais)

9 Mike Blair (Edinburgh) CAPTAIN
10 Phil Godman (Edinburgh)
11 Sean Lamont (Northampton Saints)
12 Graeme Morrison (Glasgow Warriors)
13 Ben Cairns (Edinburgh)
14 Simon Webster (Edinburgh)
15 Hugo Southwell (Edinburgh)
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rossi9!!
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Post by rossi9!! » Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:35 pm

mine
1.Jacobsen
2.Ford
3.Murray or Low
4.Hines or Kellock
5.Hamilton
6.Strokosh
7.Barclay
8.Taylor

9.Cusiter
10.Godman
11.Paterson
12.Morrison
13.Evans
14.Evans
15.Southwell

Haddens

1.Jacobsen
2.Ford
3.Murray or Cross or Low
4.Taylor
5.Hamilton
6.Brown
7.Barclay
8.Gray

9.Blair
10.Godman
11.Lamont
12.Morrison
13.Evans
14.Evans
15.Paterson

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teenwolf
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Post by teenwolf » Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:45 pm

1. Jacobsen
2. Ford
3. Cross (he was doing fine until the sin binning - murray is still out)
4. Hamilton
5. Kellock (Hines is likely to still be injured + we need a lock not a backrower)
6. Brown
7. Barclay
8. Taylor

9. Blair
10. Godman
11. Paterson (Lamont just doesn't tackle and never had any zip)
12. Morrison
13. M.Evans
14. T.Evans
15. Southwell (he was solid and there's no one else)

So I'm basically in agreement with Niall!
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barryts
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Post by barryts » Mon Feb 09, 2009 3:37 pm

Someone tell me what Allan Jacobson does apart from hall his fat a** around and drop the ball. In 4 consecutve plays he touched or was near the ball we gave away penalties and knock on's. I just can't see what he does to deserve to be there.
We need to try things with pace. Beattie and the Evan's bro's to the rescue in my opinion!Strokosh can hit anything that moves and carries well. Hines will be fit.

Mine would be this:

1. Dickinson
2. Ford
3. Cross
4. Hamilton
5. Hines
6. Strokosh
7. Barclay
8. Beattie

9. Blair
10. Godman (need to find someone else)
11. Webster
12. Morrison
13. M.Evans
14. T.Evans
15. Southwell

16. Hall
17. Lowe
18. Taylor
19. Gray (looked hungry when he came on)
20. Cusiter
21. Patterson
22. Lamont
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Post by MAFIE » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:18 pm

Agree with Baz about Jacobson. A disgrace for a professional athlete to be so out of shape. He offers nothing. In this day of professional rugby EVERY player should be able to run, pass and catch a ball, not just scrummage (and he got humped at that.) Give Jackson a go at 10. let him play from now until the world cup and give him a chance. Scotland will pick him when he is 25 and should have had 30 caps. If he's good enough he should play. Either that or play Cusiter at 9 and Blair at 10. Godman runs across the park and panicks when in good positions. He's had his chance, twice now, and flopped both times. White has been a great servant but we need to start building for the future. England got humped for two years building towards their world cup win but they bloodied all the young guys and gave them experience of playing together. I could accept defeat better if we were playing guys that have a good future, not players past their best ie... Hogg, Jacobson, White. Hadden can go first though. A school teacher in charge of the national team, you couldn't make it up! Surely we could find a place on the coaching for Finley Calder, David Soul, Hastings, Milne, etc......proper scottish legends, working under a proper rugby coach with experience. The Welsh have Jenkings and Howley. We have a kiwi and a former rugby league player.
My team would be as follows:

1. Dickinson
2. Ford
3. Cross
4. Kellock
5. Hines
6. Strokosh
7. Barclay
8. Taylor

9. Blair
10. Jackson
11. Paterson
12. Cairns
13. M.Evans
14. T.Evans
15. Southwell

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teenwolf
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Post by teenwolf » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:37 pm

agree with you on the coaching maf - but the fact is that they aren't willing to pay the money to get the best coaching for the national team and that's why we're stuck with a mediocre guy in charge.

why not do what wales have done with hook and jones. bring jackson on with 25-30mins to go and let him get experience that way. i think that it's been proven over the years that scotland can only develop world class players by playing them in the 6Ns and so on.

We have 2/3 great scrummys, that's because they (Blair, Cusiter + Lawson) are all competing for that jersey and the environment breeds excellence. At the moment, no one is pushing Godman, Jackson could be good for Godman and vice versa.

the problem is if we bring on all the young guys together then you have no leadership out there. that said, we looked rudderless anyway so what's to lose?!?
"The enemy is anybody who's going to get you killed, no matter which side he's on."
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MAFIE
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Post by MAFIE » Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:38 pm

my point exactly eddie, give murray or ford the captaincy and play all the young guys. they at least have two world cups in them. As I said england did it and took the hit for two years before they won the world cup. I'm not saying that we will win the world cup but it must be better than the mince we have to put up with now.

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Post by rossi9!! » Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:41 pm

imagine we did win the world cup tho....haha wld be flippen hilarious lol

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Post by AndyHill » Mon Feb 09, 2009 11:48 pm

Steady on Mafie some of the best coaches in the world are teachers. McGeechan, Woodward, Jake White and Gatland were all teachers and that just off the top of my head.

I his team selection was poor however I don't think anyone else will do that much of a better job. If you look at his coaching at Glasgow and Scotland it is quite impressive. I say we keep him and take the rough with the smooth. It wasnt that long ago he saved us from the dire situation Matt Williams left us in.

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Post by MAFIE » Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:02 am

the same matt williams that blooded blair and cusiter?

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Post by AndyHill » Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:14 am

Dont think you can say Matt Williams blooded blair and cusiter. It would be more realistic to say that their club coaches and international age group coaches (Hadden may very well have been one of them) blooded them. I personally wouldnt say that Brian Ashton blooded Cipriani or Woodward, Johnny Wilkinson. It is more likely that they gave them an opportunity and helped them with their development.

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niall
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Post by niall » Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:47 am

members of the current squad given their debuts by Matt Williams:
Hugo Southwell
Chris Cusiter
Sean Lamont
Dan Parks
Craig Hamilton
Ally Hogg
Graeme Morrison
Al Kellock
Rory Lamont
Scott McLeod
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Post by AndyHill » Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:57 am

So what you 2 are saying that if it was not for Matt Williams then Frank Hadden would not have these players 2 pick from? I think that is an absolute crap opinion. Bet the majority of these guys have all played international age group rugby, probably under Hadden, and then given a pro-contract. If you are saying that Matt Williams has made them the players they are today then to me that is non-sense. Blair was not half the player he was under Hadden. Paterson even said that Hadden provided them with more confidence as players and made a difference.

Williams had 3 wins in 2 years from 17 games. Those wins were over Samoa, Japan and Italy. Hadden won his first 3 games. Cant believe you are claiming that because he produced some players it is almsot regarded as a success.

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niall
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Post by niall » Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:02 am

i'm not, I was just putting some info into the argument!

It's all very well that Coaches can say they gave players their debuts (Berti Vogts with the footie is another example), but players need a good environment to play in. They need the right mentality from the coaches and to get the best from them, they need to be winning, or at least playing with confidence.
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AndyHill
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Post by AndyHill » Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:03 am

So your supporting my argument thank you Niall :D

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